From: cjra on
On Apr 23, 4:51 pm, "Me Myself and I"
<weaver.clanS...(a)slingshot.co.nz> wrote:
> I gave an indicator of what *I* pumped per side per 3 hours when my baby was
> in the NICU. The amounts were that given to me by NICU staff. 25ml each
> side every 3 hours for the first week, 50ml each side for the second week,
> then 100ml each side from then on till I was fully BF'ing. I didn't say she
> HAD to pump that amount, merely that you should aim to get the same amount
> at each sitting.

Your text certainly made it sound like this was 'normal' and entirely
reasonable. I have seen far too many women freak out about 'not
getting enough milk' because they can't pump 3+ozs per side every 3
hours because they heard somewhere that was normal. They are convinced
they have low supply and have to stop nursing. This is especially a
problem for new moms with babies in NICU. I think it's important to
remind women it's OK if they don't get an over supply, it's perfectly
normal to get no more than 2 ozs per breast in a time. Spending all
day attached to a pump to try to get one mre drop is a sure way to get
an already overwhelmed woman to quit BF altogether.

It's great you could pump so much, but that's really not the norm. I
never pumped nearly that much for the 3 weeks DD was in NICU and the
nurses said I had way more than all but one other mom there.

>I then stated if she was pumping as well as feeding and
> was pumping afterwards to increase supply she might want to pump 1 oz each
> side. My entire point was to be consistent.

It's not typical to have the same amount with each pumping session.
Supply varies throughout a 24 hr cycle, whether with nursing or with
pumping. So getting 30 mls in the evening but 100 mls in the morning
is perfectly normal and not a sign of a supply problem.

From: cjra on
On Apr 23, 4:51 pm, "Me Myself and I"
<weaver.clanS...(a)slingshot.co.nz> wrote:
> I gave an indicator of what *I* pumped per side per 3 hours when my baby was
> in the NICU. The amounts were that given to me by NICU staff. 25ml each
> side every 3 hours for the first week, 50ml each side for the second week,
> then 100ml each side from then on till I was fully BF'ing.

I have seen *so* many women come onto to support boards desparate
because they're "only" getting 2 oz per side (60mls) despite pumping
for 30-60 minutes. They are convinced they have a supply problem and
have to give up BF because they're drying up, since they don't get the
huge amounts someone suggested they _should_ be able to get. I think
it's important to remind women that it's perfectly normal to get only
1-2 ozs, and that the amount can - and does - vary from session to
session.

200 mls per pump session is _A LOT_. While my DD surely takes more at
the breast than the bottle, she only takes 3 oz (90mls) MAX when she
eats from the bottle now, at 9 months (and has never taken more except
during one week). To pump 200 mls would suggest a baby is taking more
than 2x that much at 3 weeks old in each session, or more, since very
few people can pump as much as a baby can actually extract by nursing.
Nothing wrong with it if you can do it, but it's not, IMO, a realistic
standard for other women to gauge their own production.

It's great you were able to get so much. In my 3 weeks of EP while DD
was in NICU, I rarely got more than 60mls/breast, pumping every 3 hrs
and that took awhile. Yet, according to the nurses I was a 'milk
machine' because I had so much milk there, compared to the other NICU
moms. I may very well have been on the low side of average, but it was
certainly enough. So I think one must be cautious when they suggest a
woman should be able to pump much more if they just leave themselves
attached to the pump longer. When you're an overwhelmed new mom, the
last thing you need to do is to hook yourself to a pump 24/7 for a few
more drops.


>I didn't say she
> HAD to pump that amount, merely that you should aim to get the same amount
> at each sitting. I then stated if she was pumping as well as feeding and
> was pumping afterwards to increase supply she might want to pump 1 oz each
> side. My entire point was to be consistent.

Hmm. I've had a different experience and IIRC, what I've read on
Kellymom and in LLL materials is that it's more typical to get varying
amounts throughout the day. When I was EP'ing initially, my output
varied a lot. Maybe beyond 3 weeks with EP'ing it could have become
more consistent, but it didn't then, and certainly with nursing +
pumping it's all over the place.

From: hschinske on
On Apr 22, 6:02�pm, Irrational Number <nos...(a)nospam.com> wrote:
> Anne Rogers wrote:
> >>That's the problem with us being about two
> >>generations away from when humans all
> >>breastfed.  We don't know what "natural" is
> >>when it comes to breastfeeding.  Baby is
> >>supposed to feed a lot in the beginning!
>
> > I'm not sure that's entirely true, both my husband and I come from families
> > where no generation was formula fed, yet we didn't expect that, at least not
> > beyond the first couple of weeks. All babies are different, my 2nd did not
> > feed anywhere near all the time, had she been 1st, I'd have been even more
> > surprised at my 1st feeding constantly. Many of my friends have sucessfully
> > breastfed and their babies have not fed all the time.
>
> I suppose "all the time" is an exaggeration.
> However, it is true that all of my friends
> (and I) expected that babies would feed
> once every 3-4 hours (which is a formula-fed
> "schedule"), and I don't find that true of
> breastfed babies at all!
>
> -- Anita --

Actually I hear about quite a few formula-fed babies who do the same
thing -- taking a few ounces, falling asleep, waking up very shortly
thereafter and wanting more, etc. It always pleases me to hear these
stories, actually, though it isn't very nice to say so when the
parents are struggling to get any sleep or get time to tie their shoes
or take a shower! While it may be more common for formula-fed babies
to go longer between feedings, obviously some babies act like this
regardless of whether they're getting BM or formula.

--Helen

From: Anne Rogers on

>Actually I hear about quite a few formula-fed babies who do the same
>thing -- taking a few ounces, falling asleep, waking up very shortly
>thereafter and wanting more, etc. It always pleases me to hear these
>stories, actually, though it isn't very nice to say so when the
>parents are struggling to get any sleep or get time to tie their shoes
>or take a shower! While it may be more common for formula-fed babies
>to go longer between feedings, obviously some babies act like this
>regardless of whether they're getting BM or formula.

babies are babies! I wonder if, because formula fed babies are often over
fed, that even when they do exhibit this behaviour, there is less concern
about forcing them to last the distance?

Anne